10 questions (not quite politically correct)

Evoplure · Post by **Evoplure** » Fri 19. Jan 2007, 04:52

Well, without any introduction... Any kind of answers accepted

1. Could PHPWCMS have a future without Oliver Georgi?
2. Is PHPWCMS interesting enough for developers, that they would join the project in a more open, transparent and organised platform?
3. On the other side: Is PHPWCMS interesting enough for users?
4. How that platform should be in order to be attractive for new (and current

) developers? Would you join it actively?
5. At this moment (sincerely) do you think PHPWCMS is in progress or, otherwise, is it slowly dying?
6. What is your vision of loyalty in an opensource community: to be involved deeply in a project or to respect the point of view and work of the leader?
7. How many of you had been contacted by Oliver to work in any area of PHWCMS? How many of you offered your help directly or in this forum and were not taken in consideration?
8. How many of you are thinking about stop working with PHPWCMS and/or change to another CMS? Has that decision a deadline?
9. Is there any reason to keep PHPWCMS project in this state of indefinition? Is Oliver's interest = PHPWCMS interest?
10. Are things gonna change?

jsw_nz · Post by **jsw_nz** » Fri 19. Jan 2007, 05:28

Hi Evolpure,

I do understand your questions....

Perhaps Phpwcms will go down in history as an 'also ran'

But I think - that with the release of frontend stuff that is soon to be released (Jan) - all will be good......

Oliver must be reading all these requests/questions that have been posted... not an easy job or role. OliG has consistently shown superior intelligence in forging 'smart approaches' ... so lets be patient... methinks.

Sure there are plenty of other coders and coding communities out there.. but I am a loyal follower ... awaiting smart solutions.

I think we all need to appreciate the tons of hours that OliG has been working on his creation.....

my two cents

marcus@localhorst · Post by **marcus@localhorst** » Fri 19. Jan 2007, 10:00

Oliver got a personal vision with his project. He has no contract with nobody of the users, except they pay.
I have no problem if that is an EgoTrip - it's up to him, and that should be respected. It's his way to bring it forward or not - it's like a composer or painter.
I accept that and have no Problem with that. If I need customize the code I can do it. It's free as can be.
I'm working here since 2004 and I'm very satisfied with every new version, but I don't waiting for it. Till now I need no usermanagement (and I can understand this is important for others - but...) and any other stuff is possible.
Sometimes it seems that people only like to have an complete for every special need adjusted product, without any idea about webdevelopment in detail. shure, not everybody needs to learn php for one simple website. but if you sell a phpwcms driven site, you should be able to know what happen inside.
write your own "eierlegendewollmilchsau" CMS or tryout all the others on the free market. you will find anytime things that's not your cup of tea.
and you (no you evolpure in special

- i don't know you) will always shout in the forums, when come these or that and why is it not possible.

why do you not switch to typo3? mambo/joomla? typolight? contenido? or all the other stuff (http://del.icio.us/localhorst/CMS)?

I think it's better that phpwcms is a one man show and a consitent stable thing, than a patchwork of loose developers.
Oliver know what he want and I think he is open for suggestions, but it's up to him and I respect that.
You will find a lot of userprovided code in that CMS so nobody can say he work beside the users. And if it's not fast enough for new releases... rome was not build in one day

haha - take it easy or take phpwcms-xt or something else.
it's no offense mean - but I see too much post in past with this theme, when come this or that and why not these or that... that's boring.

Better provide some funny things that you developed by yourself.

best marcus

Evoplure · Post by **Evoplure** » Fri 19. Jan 2007, 12:05

My questions were intentionally rough. But they must not be read as a critic to Oliver. This is something I want to say clearly. The only thing I would say to Oliver if I had the chance to meet him is 'thank you'. I do not share the uncollaborative side of phpwcms, but he has created one of the best cms ever and he give it to us for free. That is a powerful reason to respect Oliver's decisions, even those ones that I do not share.

Therefore, my intention was not to shout what Oliver is doing bad or wrong. I recognise that certain degree of criticisim is implied in the post, but the main issue is not to talk about what Oliver is doing but to talk about the things that an open community could do and to discuss if you all think that phpwcms would be better or worse with a different organisation of the work. Of course, for that you need to consider the weakest points in the phpwcms project and, of course, I think those weak points depend on Oliver's decisions, but I insist I respect those decisions and my intention was not criticise them but to ask about different ways of developing phpwcms.

You (marcus) say you have read too much about this in this forum. Maybe. But I am not complainig about delays or lack of transparence. Sometimes I find them dissapointing and I have expressed that dissaopintment here, but now I want to introduce a deeper level of discussion. All of us depend on the work of Oliver, we build websites for ourselves and/or for other people with phpwcms and therefore we share a certain degree of commitment for phpwcms. Not only writing php scripts, but spreading the word, analysing usability, reporting bugs, suggesting features... That is part of this bussines as well. And that is a considerable amount of work that has been involved in phpwcms in very different ways. My fears and concerns are not because of delays. Not at all. The question is more about continuity and independence. What if Oliver decides to close? Are we prepared. Wouldn't we think then that something more could have been done in these years...? What about those efforts then?

Ok. Maybe is not the first time this concerns are shown in this forum. But the questions remain unanswered. We can be blind waiting for the next release and be happy when it comes... I suppose that is what taking things easy means...

Sorry if this is boring, marcus, I don't have funny things developed by myself. I am more a graphic designer involved in usability and architecture of information issues, with a limited php background and still young in this field... I suppose that sounds quite boring and useless to you as well. But even in the case I was a real good developer I would not find it funny any thing developed by myself only if it has not a real and wide collaborative frame, and I would always try to join or create that collaborative frame...

best regards.

marcus@localhorst · Post by **marcus@localhorst** » Fri 19. Jan 2007, 12:18

be shure, I understand you and I was in a stange mood to shout out my opinion. normally I should be quiet and save my time

Everyone has an other meaning about this and that and at the end it depends on oliver and what he thinks and do, and he told that here very often. (not interested to buildup teams etc.)
if projects depending on special needs for the CMS try to find someone to cooperate. You do that what you can do best and pay the co-worker for the rest. (if it is an commercial work).
but ok, it goes beside the discussion, I'm quiet now

maybe others could say more...

best wishes marcus

phalancs · Post by **phalancs** » Mon 22. Jan 2007, 05:27

Hey, I know why you are asking these questions. I was asking them too for years - But today I got the answers that make sense for me.

Basically phpwcms is finished. Yes, I really think that most of the things that are necessary to build a good website are there. As oliver always said phpwcms is no portal system with a complete Usermanagament. And basically which system does? Typo3 - Ok but this is not alternative.

Phpwcms is a great ground to build on. Its easy to understand and easy to enhance. I am no programmer but I can realize almost everything just from exploring whats already there.

I am no more waiting for things to come. No expectations anymore. I am happy about every new feature, but I will probably not update my sites unless version 1.3 or something. I am still working with 1.2.6 and its all fine.

Oliver does a one man show but he is always open to good enhancements that meet his strict criteria (mine did not yet match his plans). Anyways this is ok, and I got used to that.

Nontheless I am pretty curious about what his usermanagement will look like